I have let this slide for quite some time but have finally got to the point where I'm ready to cut the gear, blank turned & on the mandrill. Set up the gear in 4th axis enter the .016" endmill in the tool box which is smaller than the .0176 minimum size required and get a message saying the cutter is to large, why? I tried different thing like changing the stepover, depth of cut, nothing changes. I'm doing a 48 tooth 20DP gear. I updated to V2.3005 and still get the visual of the tangental cut in the middle of the gear but as I understand that's just graphics and doesn't cut that way. Any suggestions for the cutter to large message?
Art
Cutter to large?
Re: Cutter to large?
Hi Art:
Sorry about the tooth center, I thought I caught all those, Ill check it out on a 48 tooth here.
As to the message, does it say its too large for the rooting? Or does it say Tool too large
for operation?
I think I just found a bug in the rooting message, but if it says "operation", then its concerting,
as that message looks correct and is triggered if the algorithm thinks youll cut into the tooth.
You may want to try a 49 tooth as the graphics should then be correct, ( its usualyl an even /odd problem
on my end). If the cut looks good, then it may jt be a rounding error on a tight numerical calc..
Art
Sorry about the tooth center, I thought I caught all those, Ill check it out on a 48 tooth here.
As to the message, does it say its too large for the rooting? Or does it say Tool too large
for operation?
I think I just found a bug in the rooting message, but if it says "operation", then its concerting,
as that message looks correct and is triggered if the algorithm thinks youll cut into the tooth.
You may want to try a 49 tooth as the graphics should then be correct, ( its usualyl an even /odd problem
on my end). If the cut looks good, then it may jt be a rounding error on a tight numerical calc..
Art
Re: Cutter to large?
Art,
When I hit the root wall button it's fine. If I hit Rooting I'm given the message"To many passes, diameter of bit to small for rooting" I do have the doc set at .005. When I hit Tangental "Tool appears to large for operation? Please check tool size carefully?" I will try to change to the 49 tooth tomorrow, and see if that works.
Art
When I hit the root wall button it's fine. If I hit Rooting I'm given the message"To many passes, diameter of bit to small for rooting" I do have the doc set at .005. When I hit Tangental "Tool appears to large for operation? Please check tool size carefully?" I will try to change to the 49 tooth tomorrow, and see if that works.
Art
Re: Cutter to large?
Hi Art:
It may not fix the problem but it may show any wrong assumptions. Look at the bit carefully as it cuts, if it looks good, chalk it
up to very small numbers... The rooting is warning its gonna take something like 100 passes with that bit, so just in case its
giving you a heads up..
Art
It may not fix the problem but it may show any wrong assumptions. Look at the bit carefully as it cuts, if it looks good, chalk it
up to very small numbers... The rooting is warning its gonna take something like 100 passes with that bit, so just in case its
giving you a heads up..
Art
Re: Cutter to large?
Art,
Ok I reran everything, 24tooth, 48tooth, 49tooth as you suggested and all three do the same thing that being cutting in the middle of the image of the tooth. I realize that my cutter is .016 and the called out minimum is .0176does this mean my maximum stepover should be .0008? so that its not oversized on the bottom of the tooth?
Art
Ok I reran everything, 24tooth, 48tooth, 49tooth as you suggested and all three do the same thing that being cutting in the middle of the image of the tooth. I realize that my cutter is .016 and the called out minimum is .0176does this mean my maximum stepover should be .0008? so that its not oversized on the bottom of the tooth?
Art
Re: Cutter to large?
Art:
The minimum it calls for is the computed distance for no collision, so if your ven a scratch larger, it will warn you..
Sorry about the tooth overlay, damn thing doesnt seem to do it to me, might be some setting of mine, Can you post your project here and Ill fix that immediately,just zip the .gth file its been hanging for far too long. If you can see the simulation, it usually makes more sense..
Art
The minimum it calls for is the computed distance for no collision, so if your ven a scratch larger, it will warn you..
Sorry about the tooth overlay, damn thing doesnt seem to do it to me, might be some setting of mine, Can you post your project here and Ill fix that immediately,just zip the .gth file its been hanging for far too long. If you can see the simulation, it usually makes more sense..
Art
Re: Cutter to large?
Art,
Here's the file. I hope that it's not some rookie mistake.
Art
Here's the file. I hope that it's not some rookie mistake.
Art
- Attachments
-
[The extension has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]
Re: Cutter to large?
Hi Art:
Heres the project file after I fixed it. It sends to 4th axis and displays properly now.
The only thing I really found was no master was set, for some reason the way you had it linked caused
a mesh issue, Im not sure exactly why. So first, I selected your large wheel, and right clicked and "send to design", this allowed me to regenerate it. I added it to the screen on the small gear where it meshed, but if I then tried to move it by using "Move on gear" , it woudl move, but went out of mesh.. strange. I then noticed there was no master. SO I selected the small pinion, right click - "Set as Master" , and suddenly they worked fine. I selected the lareg one, send to 4th axis, made a .017 tool and could see its a tight squeek in the root, so any error you get really isnt important, it simulated well.
Anyway, give it a shot, or just download this one. :)
Art
Heres the project file after I fixed it. It sends to 4th axis and displays properly now.
The only thing I really found was no master was set, for some reason the way you had it linked caused
a mesh issue, Im not sure exactly why. So first, I selected your large wheel, and right clicked and "send to design", this allowed me to regenerate it. I added it to the screen on the small gear where it meshed, but if I then tried to move it by using "Move on gear" , it woudl move, but went out of mesh.. strange. I then noticed there was no master. SO I selected the small pinion, right click - "Set as Master" , and suddenly they worked fine. I selected the lareg one, send to 4th axis, made a .017 tool and could see its a tight squeek in the root, so any error you get really isnt important, it simulated well.
Anyway, give it a shot, or just download this one. :)
Art
- Attachments
-
[The extension has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]
Re: Cutter to large?
Art,
Last night when I tried your instructions, when I did a root wall It came out right but the tangental was still off. I figured I'm tired I'll try it tomorrow. Today I tried your file and everything came up in the tooth. I expected your file to work properly, do I have something set up wrong? I just did the standard install. Also I didn't know anything about "set as master" is that something I missed in the tutorial video? and if so which one is it in? I have to say that trying to figure something out with the manual isn't helpful, there's no index. I understand that "here" is a resource to learn but I (maybe unfortunately) use this as a last resort. I suppose it think I should be able to figure it out.
It also gave me an error message when I tried to do the rooting function, something about to many passes. I talked to a friend of mine who does tool & die for a living and he confirmed my .005 per pass with the .016 cutter. It does end up being a lot of passes but its the right depth of cut for the small cutter. It will allow the root wall does that amount to the same thing? I think I'm about ready to try cutting the gear without the visual being correct, since both the root wall & the tangental are cutting the center of the tooth and not one in between. This will probably end up an after Christmas project as we're going out of town and I'm running out of time. I think I'll play with it next week while I'm off.
Art
Last night when I tried your instructions, when I did a root wall It came out right but the tangental was still off. I figured I'm tired I'll try it tomorrow. Today I tried your file and everything came up in the tooth. I expected your file to work properly, do I have something set up wrong? I just did the standard install. Also I didn't know anything about "set as master" is that something I missed in the tutorial video? and if so which one is it in? I have to say that trying to figure something out with the manual isn't helpful, there's no index. I understand that "here" is a resource to learn but I (maybe unfortunately) use this as a last resort. I suppose it think I should be able to figure it out.
It also gave me an error message when I tried to do the rooting function, something about to many passes. I talked to a friend of mine who does tool & die for a living and he confirmed my .005 per pass with the .016 cutter. It does end up being a lot of passes but its the right depth of cut for the small cutter. It will allow the root wall does that amount to the same thing? I think I'm about ready to try cutting the gear without the visual being correct, since both the root wall & the tangental are cutting the center of the tooth and not one in between. This will probably end up an after Christmas project as we're going out of town and I'm running out of time. I think I'll play with it next week while I'm off.
Art
Re: Cutter to large?
Hi Art:
The warning is just a warning, many people wouldnt expect to do so many passes, so its simply a heads up that many passes will be put out, expect that warning if the tool is very small. Normally, when you drop a gear on the screen, it becomes the master
automatically. Normally, youd have to unlink a gear ( something a user rarely does) for a screen project not to have a master.
Setting one is only mentioned in the video on linking gears, (Ill look up what one that is.).
There must be a bug still, that load should have kept its master set. I will investigate to see why it migght go bad again, Ill be putting out a new version in a few days with whatever I find fixed..
Art
The warning is just a warning, many people wouldnt expect to do so many passes, so its simply a heads up that many passes will be put out, expect that warning if the tool is very small. Normally, when you drop a gear on the screen, it becomes the master
automatically. Normally, youd have to unlink a gear ( something a user rarely does) for a screen project not to have a master.
Setting one is only mentioned in the video on linking gears, (Ill look up what one that is.).
There must be a bug still, that load should have kept its master set. I will investigate to see why it migght go bad again, Ill be putting out a new version in a few days with whatever I find fixed..
Art
Re: Cutter to large?
Mark:
Is it possible in the morning you grabbed the earlier file again? Testing here, my file stays good. In your bad load
do any of the gears say -Driver after their name? If not, try right clicking its name and selecting "Set as Driver"..
Does it fix it? Its quite possible that some combination your doing is triggering whatever bug this is, and causing
the reversion back to no driver, and that loss seems to be why it goes out of mesh. If you see any logic in the loss
of the word driver, let me know, Ill continue to look for any reoccurance..
Thx
Art
Is it possible in the morning you grabbed the earlier file again? Testing here, my file stays good. In your bad load
do any of the gears say -Driver after their name? If not, try right clicking its name and selecting "Set as Driver"..
Does it fix it? Its quite possible that some combination your doing is triggering whatever bug this is, and causing
the reversion back to no driver, and that loss seems to be why it goes out of mesh. If you see any logic in the loss
of the word driver, let me know, Ill continue to look for any reoccurance..
Thx
Art
Re: Cutter to large?
Art,
It occurred to me at work today that maybe I should have gone into add & delete removed the old version then downloaded the new v2.3005. if this is the case let me know and I'll try that. The version from you did say driver.
Art
It occurred to me at work today that maybe I should have gone into add & delete removed the old version then downloaded the new v2.3005. if this is the case let me know and I'll try that. The version from you did say driver.
Art
Re: Cutter to large?
Art:
No need, you never have to delete Gearotic, just install over the top.. but I dont think
its a version issue, has the file reverted after you select a driver and save it?
Art
No need, you never have to delete Gearotic, just install over the top.. but I dont think
its a version issue, has the file reverted after you select a driver and save it?
Art
Re: Cutter to large?
Art,
I'm not sure I know what you mean by revert. When I one of the gears as a driver it did remain as the driver. Yesterday when I followed your instructions about setting the driver on my gears root wall was as it should be but tangental was in the tooth. Today its back the way it was to begin with. I don't remember if I saved it that way though. Your gear set as I tried it came out wrong as well.
ArtK
I'm not sure I know what you mean by revert. When I one of the gears as a driver it did remain as the driver. Yesterday when I followed your instructions about setting the driver on my gears root wall was as it should be but tangental was in the tooth. Today its back the way it was to begin with. I don't remember if I saved it that way though. Your gear set as I tried it came out wrong as well.
ArtK
Re: Cutter to large?
Art:
Just so we don't get confused over terminology, it looks to me like we are discussing two issues,
1) A graphics issue where the tool appears in the center of a tooth so its hard to see if its cutting properly, and
2) Whether the tool is too large or not.
on 1), I cant seem to repeat this so long as a gear is selected as driver. If I then send one of the gears to the
4th axis for machining, the tool is starting dead center in the tooth space on mine. Is this the case on yours now or
is the tool in the middle of the tooth still?
on 2), the tool I tested with at .017 seems to Just Fit.. not much room , but seems to be able to do the job.
Which of the two are we talking about when you say the tangentals are in the tooth. Its the nature of the system that if rooting is properly starting in center of tooth space then tangental must as well, so are you saying rooting looks good, but
tangental is being pushed into the tooth as opposed to starting in center of it? As if the tool is too large?
Not unusual in this type of thing for terminology to be a bit of a devil for support...
Thx
Art
Just so we don't get confused over terminology, it looks to me like we are discussing two issues,
1) A graphics issue where the tool appears in the center of a tooth so its hard to see if its cutting properly, and
2) Whether the tool is too large or not.
on 1), I cant seem to repeat this so long as a gear is selected as driver. If I then send one of the gears to the
4th axis for machining, the tool is starting dead center in the tooth space on mine. Is this the case on yours now or
is the tool in the middle of the tooth still?
on 2), the tool I tested with at .017 seems to Just Fit.. not much room , but seems to be able to do the job.
Which of the two are we talking about when you say the tangentals are in the tooth. Its the nature of the system that if rooting is properly starting in center of tooth space then tangental must as well, so are you saying rooting looks good, but
tangental is being pushed into the tooth as opposed to starting in center of it? As if the tool is too large?
Not unusual in this type of thing for terminology to be a bit of a devil for support...
Thx
Art
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 17 guests